Thread: RIM's New Devices Delayed Due To New Chipset

Although Thursday's earnings calls definitely left many BlackBerry enthusiasts with a sour taste in their mouth, we did learn a few things about why the new BlackBerry devices are being delayed.

From the earnings calls:

We were already well down a development path to the next-generation BlackBerry handsets when we realized that in the US the features and performance arms race demanded that we upgrade the chipset and port BlackBerry to a higher-performance platform. This was an engineering change that affected hardware and software timelines and pushed out entry into carrier certification labs.

Even though this makes a lot of sense and answers some questions (like the fact that rumors of the Magnum and Dakota have been around for a couple of years now), it also raises a couple other ones. Like for example, what took so long for them to realize "that in the US the features and performance arms race demanded... a higher-performance platform?" Since 2009, Android's platform has been getting exponentially better. And as much as I hate to say it, even earlier, iOS has been at least trying to make these innovations and moving forward.

The heads at RIM need to be on the same page when it comes to what direction the company's going. Recently, it feels to the average consumer that a certain part of upper echelon wants to move forward and take a few risks while another side is more conservative and focus more on what RIM has done in the past and keep milking that cow as long as possible instead of pushing the envelope forward.

This last statement is trying to reserve that thought process and convey that RIM is conscience of how far behind they've fallen and that is the first step of any type of recovery: admitting there's a problem.

That being said, adapting new phones to a new OS and a new chipset (the Qualcomm Snapdragon chipset) is not an easy task. It does present a few time consuming problems which include, but aren't limited to, the actual radio coding, approval from the carriers, and the fact that RIM is adapting a new OS to the GPU feature of the new chipset which will include the "liquid graphics" side of it all.

According to Mike Lazaridis, the radio code used in this new chipset is some of the best code they've ever written which definitely gives us hope. Since RIM has control over it we should see an improvement in battery life at least (as battery drainage is mostly done by the phone's radio signal).

Without going into all the technical aspects of it, once the coding is done, integrated, and tested by RIM, it is then sent to each individual carrier to approve and once it does the phone gets released. Carriers thought can take their sweet time approving these devices and unfortunately RIM can't push them to hurry because they don't have much leverage pining carriers against carriers due to their lack of popularity in the current market.

So that's the thought process and reasoning behind the delay. We all hear RIM is trying and that they're doing the best they possibly can.

But what do you think, is it too little, too late?

It sure does seem that RIM is, on one hand, trying to rely on past successes while on the other hand, the smaller guys are shouting that things gotta change and they have been yelling that for a long time. The big boys are just starting to hear the small guys now? Reminds me of how AT&T keeps pointing back to the Apple commitment and saying, "yeah, but look what we did", not seeing that it is in the past and cannot seem to turn around to look ahead.

So does this mean devices like the 99** series are going to be delayed even more?
Maybe I didn't get it, but isn't delaying one of the problems RIM is having now? I mean, look at the Playbook or upcomming models this year... I don't think RIM has enough "fanbase" to delay longer. I think a lot of users will jump ship to others if it takes to long for new devices to be released.

Originally Posted by Poita316

So does this mean devices like the 99** series are going to be delayed even more?
Maybe I didn't get it, but isn't delaying one of the problems RIM is having now? I mean, look at the Playbook or upcomming models this year... I don't think RIM has enough "fanbase" to delay longer. I think a lot of users will jump ship to others if it takes to long for new devices to be released.

If RIM doesn't deliver soon, I'll be one of the first to leave. Apple's iPhone is eating up RIM's fanbase, and investors are calling it quits. The new Androids aren't helping either, and neither is RIM delaying what is definitely their last shot to get back on top. In my opinion, RIM's hit a dead end, and I don't think they will be able to keep up with the competition with their current way of doing things.

Originally Posted by sabisgeek

If RIM doesn't deliver soon, I'll be one of the first to leave. Apple's iPhone is eating up RIM's fanbase, and investors are calling it quits. The new Androids aren't helping either, and neither is RIM delaying what is definitely their last shot to get back on top, or even in ther middle. In my opinion, RIM's hit a dead end, and I don't think they will be able to keep up with the competition.

I feel somewhat the same.
I jumped from Nokia to RIM because I wanted a compacter, faster and more sollid smartphone. Those Communicators (9*** series and E90) where big! Tried a BB and loved it from that moment on.
I don't like iPhones (had one a month and sold it) yet Androids I never used.
I agree, delaying more / longer will be a potential nail in the coffin, which I hope doesn't happen. I don't see them go belly up soon, plenty of cash and no debt, but it will be a hard fight to maintain a secure #3 spot before WM and Nokia start spitting out new devices.
Nokia is making a smart move, the first WM devices will be launched in The Netherlands, then UK and 4 other countries. Nokia finds The Netherlands (my lovely country) as one of Europes most important markets. And by going to Europe first, they might deliver a blow to RIM who are trying to take a bit of the European market.
*looks at his Nokia 6310i* Those where the day's... A sollid device built to be used for years.

This is common in many instances in business. The guy out in front doesn't feel rushed to put out new products. So the guy behind who is going at full speed eventually catches up and takes some to the frontrunners business. This happens in all worlds of business.

I like Blackberry & this is my fifth Blackberry a Bold 9650. I would like to stay with them because of all the stuff I have gotten for the Blackberry's charging pod's / cases / power cord's / car charger's & other things. My carrier will have 4G up & running by Nov in my area & when that happens it will be hard for me to stay with Blackberry because none of us even has any idea when Blackberry will have 4G. Rim would had been better off up dating there aging phone line up instead of all that man power in the play books that they put on the market to soon come on Rim they don't even have email. The management at Rim screwed up big time & while Rim is trying to catch up the other company's aren't going to be setting still.

Personally, I blame everything on Mike Lazaridis. Who does he think he is fooling, other than himself. The other day, he is on the record for saying that the QNX OS will be available as soon as the phones are fitted with dual core processors sometime in 2012. Hello! Some Android phones are already sporting dual core processors; the Iphone 4s/5 is about to come out with a dual core processor; and the Motorola Titan is a quad core that will probably be around in 6 months time. So I'm supposed to wait longer for Rim, and settle with one of these upcoming devises that runs an already outdated and uninspiring OS 7.0, which is really 6.5, until sometime during the end of 2012? Sorry. I'm through with this company. I was loyal, updated to the Storm 2, but I'm already set on getting ready the Samsung Galaxy s2. Goodby Rim.

Originally Posted by ggr-storm1

Personally, I blame everything on Mike Lazaridis. Who does he think he is fooling, other than himself. The other day, he is on the record for saying that the QNX OS will be available as soon as the phones are fitted with dual core processors sometime in 2012. Hello! Some Android phones are already sporting dual core processors; the Iphone 4s/5 is about to come out with a dual core processor; and the Motorola Titan is a quad core that will probably be around in 6 months time. So I'm supposed to wait longer for Rim, and settle with one of these upcoming devises that runs an already outdated and uninspiring OS 7.0, which is really 6.5, until sometime during the end of 2012? Sorry. I'm through with this company. I was loyal, updated to the Storm 2, but I'm already set on getting ready the Samsung Galaxy s2. Goodby Rim.

We're sorry to see you go
But it really is your choice. You buy what you want, and if you think RIM isn't good enough for you, go ahead and buy the Galaxy S2. Good luck with it

Originally Posted by ggr-storm1

Personally, I blame everything on Mike Lazaridis. Who does he think he is fooling, other than himself. The other day, he is on the record for saying that the QNX OS will be available as soon as the phones are fitted with dual core processors sometime in 2012. Hello! Some Android phones are already sporting dual core processors; the Iphone 4s/5 is about to come out with a dual core processor; and the Motorola Titan is a quad core that will probably be around in 6 months time. So I'm supposed to wait longer for Rim, and settle with one of these upcoming devises that runs an already outdated and uninspiring OS 7.0, which is really 6.5, until sometime during the end of 2012? Sorry. I'm through with this company. I was loyal, updated to the Storm 2, but I'm already set on getting ready the Samsung Galaxy s2. Goodby Rim.

I lot of users have taken the same path, or are about to take the same path as you. When it comes down to it, I have stayed with RIM. Why? Mostly because I love BBM and push email. Which RIM is in the lead with both. I have had an iPhone, Droid, you name it, and I guess it's all about personal preference, but I had like 100 apps on my phone and only used a couple. Apps are great to have the options, but a phone is a phone. And that will always be the primary function. RIM is behind badly, but they will catch up, not before suffering some big numbers as we are seeing happen.

Personally I think that RIM has too many models out there to concentrate on. Why not concentrate on just one model like iPhone is doing? Or like Android, being a platform for whichever manufacturer out there who wants to build a phone around it.
They aretaking too much time per model and then they decided to bring out the Playbook. Why? Who was waiting for a Playbook? Instead they could have invested that time in making a more complete smartphone.
In any case I will stick to BlackBerry, because on my island 90% of the people have a BB and of course communicating thru BBM is what it’s being used for. And of that 90% a good 70% doesn’t know how to use it properly either.
Nothing else to do than sit and wait, and follow the developments on blackberryos.com.

Originally Posted by balashi

Personally I think that RIM has too many models out there to concentrate on. Why not concentrate on just one model like iPhone is doing? Or like Android, being a platform for whichever manufacturer out there who wants to build a phone around it.
They aretaking too much time per model and then they decided to bring out the Playbook. Why? Who was waiting for a Playbook? Instead they could have invested that time in making a more complete smartphone.
In any case I will stick to BlackBerry, because on my island 90% of the people have a BB and of course communicating thru BBM is what it’s being used for. And of that 90% a good 70% doesn’t know how to use it properly either.
Nothing else to do than sit and wait, and follow the developments on blackberryos.com.

I guess because consumers like variety...

And you're right Joe. Thank you for that. I can't agree with you more. That is why I never got the Iphone, or ran to get it once it moved over to Verizon. Never was nor ever will be interested in a gadget phone. However, the people at RIM have to recognize that, in addition to providing secure and instantaneous email, we Blackberry folk also need to feel that we are up there in technology in comparison to the other competitors. So gone is the Storm series. The answer was right in front of them. Upgrade the processor, and give the user the ability to decide whether they will run full hepatic touch screen mode or some level of Surepress. And lets not forget when they simply repackaged the Touch as the Bold. Now the real Bold is coming out -- and it looks great -- but it will also be obsolete right out of the box unless they find a way to allow purchasers to be able to download QNX without having to by a new one with a dual core processor. I don't know. These guys have to start listening more to and meeting the demands of their existing consumers, and I don't think they are.

Originally Posted by balashi

Personally I think that RIM has too many models out there to concentrate on. Why not concentrate on just one model like iPhone is doing? Or like Android, being a platform for whichever manufacturer out there who wants to build a phone around it.
They aretaking too much time per model and then they decided to bring out the Playbook. Why? Who was waiting for a Playbook? Instead they could have invested that time in making a more complete smartphone.
In any case I will stick to BlackBerry, because on my island 90% of the people have a BB and of course communicating thru BBM is what it’s being used for. And of that 90% a good 70% doesn’t know how to use it properly either.
Nothing else to do than sit and wait, and follow the developments on blackberryos.com.

Good points, I think that a few devices would be a good focus. A full touchscreen only, a full touchscreen keyboard slider combo, and a candy bar device like the bold with touchscreen and keyboard.

Aruba huh? Reminds me of the Beach Boys song.

Originally Posted by ggr-storm1

And you're right Joe. Thank you for that. I can't agree with you more. That is why I never got the Iphone, or ran to get it once it moved over to Verizon. Never was nor ever will be interested in a gadget phone. However, the people at RIM have to recognize that, in addition to providing secure and instantaneous email, we Blackberry folk also need to feel that we are up there in technology in comparison to the other competitors. So gone is the Storm series. The answer was right in front of them. Upgrade the processor, and give the user the ability to decide whether they will run full hepatic touch screen mode or some level of Surepress. And lets not forget when they simply repackaged the Touch as the Bold. Now the real Bold is coming out -- and it looks great -- but it will also be obsolete right out of the box unless they find a way to allow purchasers to be able to download QNX without having to by a new one with a dual core processor. I don't know. These guys have to start listening more to and meeting the demands of their existing consumers, and I don't think they are.

Right, ultimately RIM is now playing catchup in the hardware/software department. And have been trying to catch up in the apps department since the iPhone came out. If Droid can do it, why can't they?, is what RIM should be asking themselves. I don't think that they thought after being in the lead for so long that they would need to upgrade specs so fast. People want the best their money can buy, and if the iPhone or Android has better hardware than a BlackBerry, they are going to consider against getting a BB.

I hope the top guy's at BB have learn from this a few year's ago Rim had a market cap at 80 Billion & then down to 20 Billion & today at 15 Billion all because they were going to keep pushing old hardware & software. If you look at what Rim had being saying for some time they were talking about new market over seas in country's like Kenya , India & other market's like that. I think that Rim though that they could use the old hardware in those country's & get by with it & remember those aren't a high tech country's. Rim can't make it on just those type of market's they still need the U.S.A market. The top management screwed up big time. Now they are going to lay off worker's & the little people have to take the hit for what some one else did.

One of RIM's selling points is the fact that their devices are available in pretty much every carrier around the world and that there are a ton of different form factors to make consumers happy no matter what they want.

Take the Style for example, while I would probably never get it, I personally know 3 people that joined BlackBerry bc they ONLY like flip phones and since the iPhone isn't a flip phone they chose to get the Style. I definitely think that can be a double edge sword which can help but also hurt a cellphone manufacturer for the obvious reasons.

I personally think RIM needs to condense their lineup into 4 categories from here on in.

• Basic candy bar (BlackBerry Bold for high-end and BlackBerry Curve for low-end)
• Flip phone (BlackBerry Style)
• Touch screen (BlackBerry Volt)
• Slider (BlackBerry Torch)

Now I'm not a developer, so I don't know how easy or difficult it is for developers to make apps available for different phone screen sizes; etc but it probably could only help to have only 4 form factors that everyone could focus on.

That being said, competition is great for us as consumers cuz it ensures that rival companies keep moving forward, unfortunately for us, RIM hasn't yet really used this motivation to increase our satisfaction and pride(yes, pride) to be a BlackBerry owner like it use to be (think back to when Android didn't exist and the iPhone was first released and they couldn't even send MMS, or take video or get push email).

Hopefully RIM gets that back soon...

Originally Posted by jerry12

I hope the top guy's at BB have learn from this a few year's ago Rim had a market cap at 80 Billion & then down to 20 Billion & today at 15 Billion all because they were going to keep pushing old hardware & software. If you look at what Rim had being saying for some time they were talking about new market over seas in country's like Kenya , India & other market's like that. I think that Rim though that they could use the old hardware in those country's & get by with it & remember those aren't a high tech country's. Rim can't make it on just those type of market's they still need the U.S.A market. The top management screwed up big time. Now they are going to lay off worker's & the little people have to take the hit for what some one else did.

Bingo, although world markets are a bonus, they do not produce the consumption and revenue as the US Market, especially when it comes to electronics, luxuries. It seems that RIM has neglected the US Market way to much by focusing on trying to go global. Let's face the facts here, no other market has the consuming power of the US Market. I think RIM's main motivation for going global was back when RIM had the US Market lead, and the demand was high for BlackBerry globally. But all in all when it comes down to it. The US Market demands the phone with the most apps and the best specs. Most cellphone users are not worried about great push email, nor need the service. BBM is what is keeping RIM alive at this point in the software dept. And great phone design/quality, is what is keeping them alive in the aesthetics dept. Now just time to up the apps, speed, hardware (front camera)... STAT!

Originally Posted by Poita316

I feel somewhat the same.
I jumped from Nokia to RIM because I wanted a compacter, faster and more sollid smartphone. Those Communicators (9*** series and E90) where big! Tried a BB and loved it from that moment on.
I don't like iPhones (had one a month and sold it) yet Androids I never used.
I agree, delaying more / longer will be a potential nail in the coffin, which I hope doesn't happen. I don't see them go belly up soon, plenty of cash and no debt, but it will be a hard fight to maintain a secure #3 spot before WM and Nokia start spitting out new devices.
Nokia is making a smart move, the first WM devices will be launched in The Netherlands, then UK and 4 other countries. Nokia finds The Netherlands (my lovely country) as one of Europes most important markets. And by going to Europe first, they might deliver a blow to RIM who are trying to take a bit of the European market.
*looks at his Nokia 6310i* Those where the day's... A sollid device built to be used for years.

I have recently move from A Bold 9700 to Android 2.2, and I just want to say that I can't believe I hadn't done this sooner. Blackberry was great, ya, but since touching Android, I'm afriad I have been lost to their competitors. At least there is a forseeable future for Android, definitely due to the fact that it runs on SEVERAL devices, as opposed to iPhone being iPhone and Blackberry being Blackberry. I can now purchase a Samsung, HTC you name it and enjoy the same experience anywhere on multiple devices.

Rim has a lot to catch up if even they can.